Date   

Re: More Cricket & 3560 experiments

Cecil Bayona <cecil.bayona@...>
 

Sorry I meant the 2N3906 used as the oscillator currently.

On 5/14/2017 11:35 AM, Cecil Bayona cecil.bayona@k5nwa.com [4sqrp] wrote:
If you have a supply of the transistor 2n3604 used as the oscillator
replace it with the one with the highest gain, it will start oscillating
better and have higher driver. Transistor gain often varies over a wide
area for most transistors except those picked and sorted by gain. That
particular device the gain varies from 30 to 300, if you have one on the
low end you will have oscillating problems.
Another thought is to replace the 2n3604 oscillator transistor with a
BC550C transistor, same frequency response, lower noise, but much higher
gain, it will start easier, require less drive and have higher output.
Often not found in the parts bin the SS9014DBU has extremely low noise
and very high gain.
On 5/14/2017 10:51 AM, 'Jim Sheldon' w0eb@cox.net [4sqrp] wrote:
> Hi Gang,
> The other day Jim, N5IB mentioned that if high ESR was a problem with
> the HC-49/US crystals, why not parallel 2 of them. At first I thought
> he was joking, but after pondering it a bit I got to thinking it might
> work, but also that there might not be enough drive. Paralleling 2
> equal impedances (or resistances) gets you half the ESR of one, but you
> also wind up with more shunt current and subsequently lower drive from
> the oscillator transistor. I find that my thinking on this was correct.
>
> The oscillator starts reliably with two of the HC-49/US crystals I got
> off eBay, but the drive is low enough that the output is only .28 watts
> and Q2 gets extremely hot, extremely quickly. Even a short CQ runs the
> risk of destroying Q2 so while 2 crystals in parallel gives reliable
> oscillation, there's insufficient drive to put Q2 into Class E which
> causes very high average drain current and rapid heating of the
> transistor due to the much lower efficiency.
>
> I do have some full size HC-49/U crystals coming tomorrow or Tuesday
> that have an ESR of around 150 ohms or maybe a tad less. We'll see if
> these work. If not then it's play with the feedback. Right now I have
> 147 pF in C9 and 220 pF in C10. I've had those in and out enough times
> that I don't want to risk lifting the pads with too many more changes.
> Hopefully the /U crystals will function.
>
> Jim, W0EB
>
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------
> Posted by: "Jim Sheldon" <w0eb@cox.net>
--
Cecil - k5nwa
http://thepartsplace.k5nwa.com/
------------------------------------------------------------------------
Posted by: Cecil Bayona <cecil.bayona@k5nwa.com>


Re: More Cricket & 3560 experiments

Cecil Bayona <cecil.bayona@...>
 

If you have a supply of the transistor 2n3604 used as the oscillator replace it with the one with the highest gain, it will start oscillating better and have higher driver. Transistor gain often varies over a wide area for most transistors except those picked and sorted by gain. That particular device the gain varies from 30 to 300, if you have one on the low end you will have oscillating problems.

Another thought is to replace the 2n3604 oscillator transistor with a BC550C transistor, same frequency response, lower noise, but much higher gain, it will start easier, require less drive and have higher output.

Often not found in the parts bin the SS9014DBU has extremely low noise and very high gain.

On 5/14/2017 10:51 AM, 'Jim Sheldon' w0eb@cox.net [4sqrp] wrote:
Hi Gang,
The other day Jim, N5IB mentioned that if high ESR was a problem with
the HC-49/US crystals, why not parallel 2 of them. At first I thought
he was joking, but after pondering it a bit I got to thinking it might
work, but also that there might not be enough drive. Paralleling 2
equal impedances (or resistances) gets you half the ESR of one, but you
also wind up with more shunt current and subsequently lower drive from
the oscillator transistor. I find that my thinking on this was correct.
The oscillator starts reliably with two of the HC-49/US crystals I got
off eBay, but the drive is low enough that the output is only .28 watts
and Q2 gets extremely hot, extremely quickly. Even a short CQ runs the
risk of destroying Q2 so while 2 crystals in parallel gives reliable
oscillation, there's insufficient drive to put Q2 into Class E which
causes very high average drain current and rapid heating of the
transistor due to the much lower efficiency.
I do have some full size HC-49/U crystals coming tomorrow or Tuesday
that have an ESR of around 150 ohms or maybe a tad less. We'll see if
these work. If not then it's play with the feedback. Right now I have
147 pF in C9 and 220 pF in C10. I've had those in and out enough times
that I don't want to risk lifting the pads with too many more changes.
Hopefully the /U crystals will function.
Jim, W0EB
------------------------------------------------------------------------
Posted by: "Jim Sheldon" <w0eb@cox.net>


Re: Bayou Jumper Case

m p
 

I would also be interested.

Mark
KA8ONW



From: "Lionking45 lionking45@... [4sqrp]" <4sqrp@...>
To: 4sqrp@...; richard.dickerson@...
Sent: Sunday, May 14, 2017 5:50 AM
Subject: Re: [4sqrp] Bayou Jumper Case

 
I am interested

Ariel NY4G

Sent from my iPad

On May 14, 2017, at 05:50, richard.dickerson@... [4sqrp] <4sqrp@...> wrote:

 
I was in in Hobby Lobby today and noticed they were out of the boxes we use for the Bayou Jumper.  That started me thinking about alternatives. I found a company that makes custom hollow books.  Who would be interested in a Bayou Jumper sized hollow book titled Rebecca or Key to Rebecca?  Perhaps the art of war or on war?  If enough of us are interested (minimum of 5) we can get a quote.  Standard offerings are about $25.  Seems very cloak and dagger.

Richard 
WF2F



Virus-free. www.avast.com


Re: 3579 and the Cricket

Richard Dickerson
 

3578.5 to 3579.5 is the JT9 hot spot but use seems to have declined with longer days. Richard WF2F

Sent from my iPhone

On May 14, 2017, at 12:17, 'Jim Sheldon' w0eb@... [4sqrp] <4sqrp@...> wrote:

 

Forgot to mention to those who made comments on a previous message about
"re-taking" 3579 from the digital crowd. That will never happen unless
everyone using 3579 goes QRO as the digi bunch totally ignores any
signals that don't have a real effect on their QSO's as they never
listen to the frequency before they transmit anyway in total disregard
of the rules. Besides if we were to also disregard the rules and
deliberately QRM them, that would also be a flagrant disregard for the
rules and isn't really kosher either as no one person or group "owns" a
frequency regardless of whether or not their rigs are only crystal
controlled.

I have no reason to not use 3579 when the frequency is clear, but it
will be nice to have 3560 available as well, especially with only .5 to
1 watt out of the Cricket and a "Cricketeer" award to work toward. So
far I have not been able to make any contacts with my Cricket even
though I have been calling CQ for minutes on end in the evenings and
even during the day when testing the mods in the attempt to get 3560
working as well. The only Cricket I've even heard on 3579 has been
Terry, WA0ITP and I had to work him using my K3S turned down to 1 watt
because my Cricket kit had not arrived at that time.

Mine has been on the air daily but with no luck to date. At age 75, I
find it extremely difficult to stay up much past 10 p.m. so the real
late night/early morning sessions are pretty much a bust for me. There
are several Crickets in the area but unbuilt as currently no readily
available 3560 crystals have been found to work and they have listened
to the painful digital racket on 3579 every evening so far.


3579 and the Cricket

Jim Sheldon
 

Forgot to mention to those who made comments on a previous message about
"re-taking" 3579 from the digital crowd. That will never happen unless
everyone using 3579 goes QRO as the digi bunch totally ignores any
signals that don't have a real effect on their QSO's as they never
listen to the frequency before they transmit anyway in total disregard
of the rules. Besides if we were to also disregard the rules and
deliberately QRM them, that would also be a flagrant disregard for the
rules and isn't really kosher either as no one person or group "owns" a
frequency regardless of whether or not their rigs are only crystal
controlled.

I have no reason to not use 3579 when the frequency is clear, but it
will be nice to have 3560 available as well, especially with only .5 to
1 watt out of the Cricket and a "Cricketeer" award to work toward. So
far I have not been able to make any contacts with my Cricket even
though I have been calling CQ for minutes on end in the evenings and
even during the day when testing the mods in the attempt to get 3560
working as well. The only Cricket I've even heard on 3579 has been
Terry, WA0ITP and I had to work him using my K3S turned down to 1 watt
because my Cricket kit had not arrived at that time.

Mine has been on the air daily but with no luck to date. At age 75, I
find it extremely difficult to stay up much past 10 p.m. so the real
late night/early morning sessions are pretty much a bust for me. There
are several Crickets in the area but unbuilt as currently no readily
available 3560 crystals have been found to work and they have listened
to the painful digital racket on 3579 every evening so far.


Re: Bayou Jumper Case

William Wisbey
 

I'd be interested as well.

Allen Wisbey, W1SBY


On May 14, 2017, at 4:50 AM, Lionking45 lionking45@... [4sqrp] <4sqrp@...> wrote:

 

I am interested

Ariel NY4G

Sent from my iPad

On May 14, 2017, at 05:50, richard.dickerson@... [4sqrp] <4sqrp@...> wrote:

 

I was in in Hobby Lobby today and noticed they were out of the boxes we use for the Bayou Jumper.  That started me thinking about alternatives. I found a company that makes custom hollow books.  Who would be interested in a Bayou Jumper sized hollow book titled Rebecca or Key to Rebecca?  Perhaps the art of war or on war?  If enough of us are interested (minimum of 5) we can get a quote.  Standard offerings are about $25.  Seems very cloak and dagger.


Richard 

WF2F


More Cricket & 3560 experiments

Jim Sheldon
 

Hi Gang,
The other day Jim, N5IB mentioned that if high ESR was a problem with
the HC-49/US crystals, why not parallel 2 of them. At first I thought
he was joking, but after pondering it a bit I got to thinking it might
work, but also that there might not be enough drive. Paralleling 2
equal impedances (or resistances) gets you half the ESR of one, but you
also wind up with more shunt current and subsequently lower drive from
the oscillator transistor. I find that my thinking on this was correct.

The oscillator starts reliably with two of the HC-49/US crystals I got
off eBay, but the drive is low enough that the output is only .28 watts
and Q2 gets extremely hot, extremely quickly. Even a short CQ runs the
risk of destroying Q2 so while 2 crystals in parallel gives reliable
oscillation, there's insufficient drive to put Q2 into Class E which
causes very high average drain current and rapid heating of the
transistor due to the much lower efficiency.

I do have some full size HC-49/U crystals coming tomorrow or Tuesday that have an ESR of around 150 ohms or maybe a tad less. We'll see if
these work. If not then it's play with the feedback. Right now I have
147 pF in C9 and 220 pF in C10. I've had those in and out enough times
that I don't want to risk lifting the pads with too many more changes.
Hopefully the /U crystals will function.

Jim, W0EB


Re: Bayou Jumper Case

Ariel Jacala
 

I am interested

Ariel NY4G

Sent from my iPad

On May 14, 2017, at 05:50, richard.dickerson@... [4sqrp] <4sqrp@...> wrote:

 

I was in in Hobby Lobby today and noticed they were out of the boxes we use for the Bayou Jumper.  That started me thinking about alternatives. I found a company that makes custom hollow books.  Who would be interested in a Bayou Jumper sized hollow book titled Rebecca or Key to Rebecca?  Perhaps the art of war or on war?  If enough of us are interested (minimum of 5) we can get a quote.  Standard offerings are about $25.  Seems very cloak and dagger.


Richard 

WF2F


Re: Cricket chirping CQ on 3580

Robert Rode <Midnitetoaker1958@...>
 

...Jim,.. Glad to see your using 3580,.. as we all know, long ago 3579 was THE freq to play Home Brew on,.. I certainly enjoyed it,.. and was a member of CBLA...Color Burst Liberation Army,.. intent was to " re take freq from the digital clicks and screeches,.. I even had a small splinter group meet around  midnite,  was much fun,..called our little group " The Nite Watchmen "..It slowly fell apart sad to see...I keep a Heathkit DX-60 with a 3579 xtal soldered behind the panel on the switch  ,.. kinda permanent,..Keep it up,... see ya 72 /73 de W9ESX Chicago..

On Sat, May 13, 2017 at 9:08 PM, 'Jim Sheldon' w0eb@... [4sqrp] <4sqrp@...> wrote:
 

So much for 3580 tonight. There's an RTTY contest going and the RTTY
guys aren't listening for QRP CW signals. Between them and the PSK
stuff 3580 is going to be hammered.

Jim - W0EB

------ Original Message ------
From: "Tom Sevart tmsevart@... [4sqrp]" <4sqrp@...>
To: "4SQRP Group" <4sqrp@...>
Sent: 5/13/2017 8:55:08 PM
Subject: [4sqrp] Cricket chirping CQ on 3580

>Calling CQ on 3580 at 0154 UTC.
>
>
>--
>Tom Sevart N2UHC
>St. Paul, KS
>
>---
>This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
>https://www.avast.com/antivirus
>
>
>
>------------------------------------
>Posted by: Tom Sevart <tmsevart@...>
>------------------------------------
>
>4SQRP Website: http://4sqrp.com
>Plan to attend OzarkCon on - April 6-7, 2018
>View Details at http://www.ozarkcon.com/index.php
>------------------------------------
>
>Yahoo Groups Links
>
>
>



Bayou Jumper Case

Richard Dickerson
 

I was in in Hobby Lobby today and noticed they were out of the boxes we use for the Bayou Jumper.  That started me thinking about alternatives. I found a company that makes custom hollow books.  Who would be interested in a Bayou Jumper sized hollow book titled Rebecca or Key to Rebecca?  Perhaps the art of war or on war?  If enough of us are interested (minimum of 5) we can get a quote.  Standard offerings are about $25.  Seems very cloak and dagger.


Richard 

WF2F


Re: Cricket chirping CQ on 3580

Jim Sheldon
 

So much for 3580 tonight. There's an RTTY contest going and the RTTY
guys aren't listening for QRP CW signals. Between them and the PSK
stuff 3580 is going to be hammered.

Jim - W0EB

------ Original Message ------
From: "Tom Sevart tmsevart@gmail.com [4sqrp]" <4sqrp@yahoogroups.com>
To: "4SQRP Group" <4sqrp@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: 5/13/2017 8:55:08 PM
Subject: [4sqrp] Cricket chirping CQ on 3580

Calling CQ on 3580 at 0154 UTC.


--
Tom Sevart N2UHC
St. Paul, KS

---
This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
https://www.avast.com/antivirus



------------------------------------
Posted by: Tom Sevart <tmsevart@gmail.com>
------------------------------------

4SQRP Website: http://4sqrp.com
Plan to attend OzarkCon on - April 6-7, 2018
View Details at http://www.ozarkcon.com/index.php
------------------------------------

Yahoo Groups Links



Cricket chirping CQ on 3580

Tom Sevart
 

Calling CQ on 3580 at 0154 UTC.


--
Tom Sevart N2UHC
St. Paul, KS


Crystal ESR - was Cricket musings

WA0ITP
 

GM John,

Thanks for the excellent post, good info, nothing better than having data.  Cricket users have discovered that some (most) HC49S crystals wont oscillate, but that the HC49U crystals will perform ok.  Actually some of those didn't oscillate reliably either, resulting in changes in R9 and R10 before going into production.  In an earlier post, NM0S also provided insight into higher ESR requiring more feedback. Thanks for mentioning 200p and 470p for C9 and C10.  The  Cricket is a very open design and several builders have  experimented with the feedback, and probably will continue to do so.

Thanks again.
72 WAØITP
I love this radio stuff. 
www.wa0itp.com
www.4sqrp.com
On 5/12/2017 10:09 PM, jwc123@... [4sqrp] wrote:

 

JAN is no longer making crystals either? Wow!

Last night and a little today I was home brewing and experimenting with part of the cricket while waiting for the official kit to arrive.

An ESR more than 100 may be a bit high for this circuit.  My HC49S (short case) 3.579's are measuring around 124 ohms and will not fire up without adding extra capacitance to C9 (200pF) and C10 (470pF).  It might take less but 470pF is a standard values I normally use for 80M so just popped in to test.  C9 at 100pF didn't fire up so maybe somewhere between 100-200pF.  The Rx/Tx shift is also low, around 300Hz replacing C15 with a gimmick.

For the HC49S (short case) 3535 3550 and 3560 the ESR measures around 70-80 ohms and most of the time fired up but it has failed a few times on the prototyping board.  Again adding a little extra to C10 cured the problem.


The above all have specs of a 150 ohm ESR maximum, 30ppm tolerance, and an 18pF load capacitance.  Measurements were with an old Saunders Crystal Impedance Meter.  I can't guarantee 4 digit accuracy but calibrations show it's close enough for government work.

Also played with an HC49U (tall case) 3.6864 from the junk box.  Putting it on the meter gave an ESR of 74 ohms and found out it was a series crystal.  Still worked.  Maybe I'll give a CQ to those Extra Phone guys one day.... hi hi  I have a small hand-full of these up for grabs. If anyone is interested in a couple give me a shout and I'll send them your way.

If you want a gang-buster output then find an old BIG (HC6/U?) TV colorburst crystal.  10 ohms ESR and the voltage output on the o-scope more than doubled.  I wonder if that will drive the MOSFET too hard once that part of the circuit is done?

Having too much fun but need to call it a night, will continue the fun when the kit arrives......

72 John kc9on


 



SSS is tomorrow

John Lonigro
 

This is your 2nd and probably last reminder that the 4SQRP SSS (Second Sunday Sprint) is tomorrow night (Sunday), from 7:00-9:00pm CDT (0000-0200Z Monday). Go to the 4SQRP website for detailed rules. As usual, reporting is done via qrpcontest.com. There's a copy of the rules there as well.

Think of it as CW practice for Field Day, which is only a little more than a month away.

72,

John, AA0VE
4SQRP Contest Coordinator


Re: A bug deterrent for the garrden

W0IIT
 

Walter,

Fine Business post about the designers and the kitters/shippers. I think few folks attending OzarkCon stop and think = WOW!!!!! the volunteers really busted their butts this year and look what it did for me!!!! I’m not criticizing just pointing out that we all enjoy OzarkCon but it wouldn’t happen without the people you listed——THANK YOU. Gals and Guys. The spouses of the kitters you listed aren’t mentioned but I know from personal experience that the kitting I did impacted Patsy KC5CDE as much if not more than it did me. The spouse might actually pitch in and do some of the kitting but others just accept and allow for the time that the process takes out of their life.

Again, THANK YOU!!!!

cu es 72 Bart W0IIT
Pittsburg, KS


Re: Cricket musings

John Clements
 

JAN is no longer making crystals either? Wow!

Last night and a little today I was home brewing and experimenting with part of the cricket while waiting for the official kit to arrive.

An ESR more than 100 may be a bit high for this circuit.  My HC49S (short case) 3.579's are measuring around 124 ohms and will not fire up without adding extra capacitance to C9 (200pF) and C10 (470pF).  It might take less but 470pF is a standard values I normally use for 80M so just popped in to test.  C9 at 100pF didn't fire up so maybe somewhere between 100-200pF.  The Rx/Tx shift is also low, around 300Hz replacing C15 with a gimmick.

For the HC49S (short case) 3535 3550 and 3560 the ESR measures around 70-80 ohms and most of the time fired up but it has failed a few times on the prototyping board.  Again adding a little extra to C10 cured the problem.

The above all have specs of a 150 ohm ESR maximum, 30ppm tolerance, and an 18pF load capacitance.  Measurements were with an old Saunders Crystal Impedance Meter.  I can't guarantee 4 digit accuracy but calibrations show it's close enough for government work.

Also played with an HC49U (tall case) 3.6864 from the junk box.  Putting it on the meter gave an ESR of 74 ohms and found out it was a series crystal.  Still worked.  Maybe I'll give a CQ to those Extra Phone guys one day.... hi hi  I have a small hand-full of these up for grabs. If anyone is interested in a couple give me a shout and I'll send them your way.

If you want a gang-buster output then find an old BIG (HC6/U?) TV colorburst crystal.  10 ohms ESR and the voltage output on the o-scope more than doubled.  I wonder if that will drive the MOSFET too hard once that part of the circuit is done?

Having too much fun but need to call it a night, will continue the fun when the kit arrives......

72 John kc9on


 


Re: Cricket musings

4sqrp-owner@...
 

Jim, et al,

I can't speak for the first 100 kit run, but the current run of Crickets uses Digikey P/N ECS-35-S-1X. Specs listed on their website.

Gary/w0gx


Re: Cricket musings

wa2cky
 


On Fri, May 12, 2017 at 2:59 PM, n5ib@... [4sqrp] <4sqrp@...> wrote:
# 449-LFXTAL017586BULK

Excellent detective work!  These are actually crystals with actual specifications.  And darned inexpensive also.  Another user indicated the ESR (no idea if a maximum) for the color burst crystal was 200 ohms.  The Mouser ones are specified at 150 ohms MAXIMUM so they should work very well in the Cricket. I need some other parts for some radio restorations so I think I will add a number of these into my order.   If and when someone tries these, let us know how they work out.

Bob Groh, WA2CKY


Re: Cricket musings

Jim Sheldon
 

Spec for color burst crystals ESR is max 200 ohms but I'd like to know where the supplied crystals came from. That way it would be easier to figure out what their nominal ESR actually is. Sure would help determine if a particular supplier's 3560 crystals are even worth trying.

W0EB

On May 12, 2017, at 2:59 PM, n5ib@juno.com [4sqrp] <4sqrp@yahoogroups.com> wrote:


Mouser shows # 449-LFXTAL017586BULK
HC-49 case 3.56 MHz for $0.38 each...

also # 449-LFXTAL010041BULK
HC-49 case 3.5625 MHz also $0.38 each

Spec is ESR of 150 ohms - is that the deal breaker?

N5IB







---In 4sqrp@yahoogroups.com, <w0eb@...> wrote :

First off, thanks Terry for posting the "Cricket Notes" yesterday. They
are all good advice and timely as well. I was searching for a source of
the HC-49/U larger size crystals for 3560


Re: Cricket musings

Curt
 

QRV with Cricket 3579 and 3560 xtal most mornings.   72, Curt KB5JO

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