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Re: Ice Storm in Michigan - generators
Shawn Reed <neivahul@...>
On 12/30/2013 3:41 PM,
wmorrill@... wrote:
It is sort of like being on the grid, or not. You are far better off not being on the grid. Every thing has it's own fate. Shawnr kf7yff
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Re: Ice Storm in Michigan - generators
Wendell Morrill
I was thinking about long term emergency situations. I assumed that
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natural gas via pipelines would be reliable, but if the pipes must be pressurized for the system to work, perhaps the pumps that supply the pressure might be inoperative.
On 12/30/2013 2:20 PM, wmorrill@montana.edu wrote:
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Re: Ice Storm in Michigan - generators
Shawn Reed <neivahul@...>
On 12/30/2013 2:20 PM,
wmorrill@... wrote:
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Re: Ice Storm in Michigan - generators
cbayona <CBayona@...>
Natural gas uses compressors to maintain the line pressure, those compressors require electricity to pump but they have backup systems in case electrical power fails.
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You would never ever want air inside the gas lines, air contains oxygen, the gas is flammable, putting air in a line full of combustible material is turning the pipe into a bomb waiting for the slightest spark or open flame to go off.
At 04:20 PM 12/30/2013, you wrote:
Question - Do natural gas lines ever shut down? Are they pressurized with --
Cecil - k5nwa < http://thepartsplace.k5nwa.com/ > < http://www.softrockradio.org/ > Never take life seriously. Nobody gets out alive anyway.
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Re: Ice Storm in Michigan - generators
Wendell Morrill
Question - Do natural gas lines ever shut down? Are they pressurized with
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air, and if so, how reliable are the pumps? Wendell
Hi,
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Re: Ice Storm in Michigan
The gensets at work are all scheduled to exercise approximately 30
minutes each week. They are fueled by propane so condensation or fuel degradation isn't the issue. They are monitored by an alarm system which will issue a notification should an exercise be missed. This has caught a lot of issues before the ybecame another emergency within an emergency! As for fuel, I use SeaFoam a lot and that helps. I've found that it works as both a stabilizer and fuel system cleaner. We're running my brother's portable generator on year old fuel with little ill effect. If the fuel can be kept in an area without large temperature swings, I think that helps. For those that want to deal with it, diesel is another choice and while the fuel remains stable over time, one must prepare it for cold weather or jelling will occur. Everything is a trade-off. Our club is looking to add the multi-fuel conversion to the Honda generator so that in a pinch propane can be used if gas is not readily available. Most everyone has a propane bottle for a grill and such. 72, de Nate >> -- "The optimist proclaims that we live in the best of all possible worlds. The pessimist fears this is true." Ham radio, Linux, bikes, and more: http://www.n0nb.us
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Re: Ice Storm in Michigan - generators
Bill Cromwell
Hi,
My experience with "emergency" or "alternate" power sources fits right in. Use it or lose it. I went shares with a brother-in-law on a nice generator unit and he kept it at his home - where it was much more likely to be needed. HOA, urban environment, all of that helpless stuff. It sat in the corner of his garage untouched for about two years. All of you know what happened when he actually needed it. Well his basement flooded. Them city folk don't know any better than to build houses down in a hole where a pump is required to keep it from flooding. In the same power outage at my home all the rain ran down the hill *away* from the house. I plan to build up a natural gas powered generator and supply the whole village when the power goes out. Oh wait - it ain't April yet. The electric utilities (no names but "Consumer's Energy") here used to repair power outages in minutes to a few hours. The past decade or so they seem to think it's okay to leave us without water and heat for days and weeks. Please 'scuse my bad attitude toward them. The water I need to pump is from my well - NOT from my basement. This house ain't built down in a hole, either. If you have them - use them. 73, Bill KU8H
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Re: Ice Storm in Michigan
email4utoo@...
i was under the impression on Generator periodic Starts was to keep condensation as well from forming , and was told to keep the tank full thru winter by a mechanic to help this . Just FYI , will have to study up on this , yes i also start our's every so often, not nearly as much as you all are , my manual start is getting old like i am , lol. 73's AJ
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Re: Serial interface question
Wayne Dillon
A card with "proper" serial ports will cause you much less heartache in the long run. I tried the PS/2 path and gave up before i got ulcers! I believe they are quite inexpensive. Why give up XP? I know windows is stopping support next year but frankly I don't feel I can rely on windows for support on any of their products - just me personal experience.
God Bless all and a happy, prosperous and peaceful new year to all. Wayne - KC0PMH
On Sun, Dec 29, 2013 at 4:12 PM, John R. Lonigro <jonigro@...> wrote:
--
http://www.qsl.net/kc0pmh/ Under construction but please visit anyway.
QRP - EFFICIENCY AND SKILL, NOT POWER.
I'm British by birth but American by CHOICE! Jesus came to pay a debt He didn't owe because we owe a debt we cannot pay... The Lord bless you and keep you The Lord make His face shine upon you, and be gracious unto you The Lord lift up his contenance upon you and give you peace. God Bless from Wayne Dillon - KC0PMH Joshua 24:14-15 2 Cor 5:17 1 Jn 2:17 4 State QRP Group NCS - 40m & 160m 4SQRP #95
FPQRP #342 (Flying Pigs QRP Club) G-QRP-C #11504 NAQCC # 0759
QRP-ARCI #11505 SKCC #1155C SOC #848 30MDG#1176 NEQRP #693 GORC #192 DMC (Digital Modes Club) # 06686
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Re: Serial interface question
John Lonigro
Thanks to all for the suggestions. The computer I'm buying is a weird one. Think of it as a laptop without a keyboard/mouse/or monitor. I don't think normal-sized PCI cards will fit. I won't receive it until later this week, but it's about 10" square by about 2.5" high. I'm thinking my best bet would be a USB to serial converter, which I've used successfully in the past. I can buy PS/2 to serial adapters and I can even program a PIC circuit to convert PS/2 synchronous serial to RS232 standards if need be, but unless I can address that port as a "com" port on the firmware/software side, it won't work. The computer would either ignore the signals or perhaps convert them to some crazy mouse movement or keyboard press. This beast has 8 USB ports, so I don't think I really have a problem. I just saw those two PS/2 ports sitting there unused and started wondering. I can always dig out some old PS/2 keyboards/mice and utilize the ports as they were designed to be utilized.
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Thanks again and 72, John AA0VE
On 12/29/2013 05:37 PM, Tim McDonough N9PUZ wrote:
I tried unsuccessfully to do this a while back and gave up. It may be possible but it was frustrating plus I discovered that you can inexpensively buy a card with a pair of genuine RS232 style serial ports with 9-pin connectors. These will work perfectly even in applications that use individual port lines for keying, etc.
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Re: Serial interface question
Tim N9PUZ
I tried unsuccessfully to do this a while back and gave up. It may be possible but it was frustrating plus I discovered that you can inexpensively buy a card with a pair of genuine RS232 style serial ports with 9-pin connectors. These will work perfectly even in applications that use individual port lines for keying, etc.
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Tim N9PUZ
On 12/29/2013 4:12 PM, John R. Lonigro wrote:
I'm upgrading my old Windows computer to a newer (but not new) one,
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Re: Serial interface question
Presumably you have one or two open PCI slots on the main board. An
adapter card that provides serail ports are readily available, as I recall. I've had no problem with the typical USB to serial adapter but then I've not needed the extra control lines that are often lacking from those adapaters. 72, de Nate >> -- "The optimist proclaims that we live in the best of all possible worlds. The pessimist fears this is true." Ham radio, Linux, bikes, and more: http://www.n0nb.us
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Re: Serial interface question
Julio Jimenez <ak4vl.qrp@...>
John, I've personally never done this, but a quick google search rendered quite a few adapters. I think it's going to come down to wiring, meaning that the keyboard and mouse PS/2 wiring is different. I think you would have a better chance at turning the keyboard PS/2 into an RS-232 serial port --> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PS/2_port (second paragraph under Port Availability).
I'm curious as to the outcome, please let us know how it works out! :-) VY 72 ES HNY DE AK4VL Julio Jimenez
On Sun, Dec 29, 2013 at 5:12 PM, John R. Lonigro <jonigro@...> wrote:
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Serial interface question
John Lonigro
I'm upgrading my old Windows computer to a newer (but not new) one, mainly to convert from Windows XP to Windows 7 for when Microsoft abandons XP in early 2014. The newer one has many USB ports and two PS/2 ports, but no serial ports. I'm wondering if it is possible to use a PS/2 to serial adapter in order to get a usable serial port on this machine. I'm mainly wondering if the OS will allow those PS/2 ports to be addressed as if they were standard serial ports or if they are wired specifically for a keyboard and mouse. I've got a USB to serial converter cable, but was just wondering about those two ports which will otherwise go unused, since my keyboard and mouse are both USB.
Does anybody have any experience with this? Thanks in advance, John AA0VE
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Re: Ice Storm in Michigan
John Lonigro
I bought my 2 kW Honda inverting generator mainly for emergencies. It easily runs the refrigerator and TV (for emergency entertainment). Fortunately, real emergencies are few and far between. But the reason I bought the Honda vs some other brand is the Honda is very quiet and provides enough power at Field Day for fans during the day, lighting during the night, and a coffee maker in the early morning. I used it for that more than for emergencies. Stabilizer in the fuel helps prevent "shellac", "varnish", or whatever gasoline becomes when the highly volatile component goes away. Regardless, I make sure none of the gas in my portable containers or equipment gas tanks is anywhere close to 6 months old. Gas is NOT like wine or women - it doesn't get better with age.
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John AA0VE
On 12/29/2013 01:03 PM, Jim Sheldon wrote:
My Generac 9500 portable recommends running for 10-15 minutes every 30 days on gasoline. I hook it up and run it on NG every 15 days for long enough to get the oil up to temp when it's cold out - usually around 15 mins and plan on a 10 min run in warmer WX. At least once a month I put a full load on it as recommended. Ought to keep from having any surprises if it's ever really needed. I've never even filled the gasoline tank to prevent that "shellac" from forming.
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Re: Ice Storm in Michigan
My Generac 9500 portable recommends running for 10-15 minutes every 30 days on gasoline. I hook it up and run it on NG every 15 days for long enough to get the oil up to temp when it's cold out - usually around 15 mins and plan on a 10 min run in warmer WX. At least once a month I put a full load on it as recommended. Ought to keep from having any surprises if it's ever really needed. I've never even filled the gasoline tank to prevent that "shellac" from forming. Jim W0EB Sent from my iPad
On Dec 29, 2013, at 12:37 PM, "WA0ITP" <wa0itp@...> wrote:
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Re: Ice Storm in Michigan
Phil Anderson
Hey Terry............that's a cool system.....
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Unc Phil............happy new year !!!!! WA0ITP wrote:
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Re: Ice Storm in Michigan
WA0ITP
My Generac whole house generator automatically fires up once a week, does a
self diagnostic routine, runs for 10 minutes, then goes back to sleep for a
week.
---------------------------------- Back to the bench, Winter's too valuable to waste. I love this radio stuff ! 72 WA0ITP www.wa0itp.com www.4sqrp.com
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Re: Ice Storm in Michigan
Paul
My 75 cents (2 cents adjusted for inflation)
Generators require periodic exercising. You cannot just install one,
let it set several years and expect it to work when you want it.
Onan recommends I run the auxiliary gasoline generator on my motor home for
2 hours each month. This keeps the gasoline from turning to lacquer in the
carburetor.
Many years ago my employer installed Onan diesel generators and they
required monthly exercising.
Gasoline will not keep forever. Remember the first time you want to
use your gasoline lawn mower in the spring and it will not start? Fresh
gasoline usually cures that.
I have no experience or knowledge about natural gas powered engines.
Our toys do require maintenance.
Paul, W8AEF
From: Nate Bargmann
Sent: Sunday, December 29, 2013 8:55 AM
To: 4sqrp@...
Subject: Re: [4sqrp] Ice Storm in Michigan A manual transfer switch from Ronk (or others) is not that expensive.
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Re: Ice Storm in Michigan
A manual transfer switch from Ronk (or others) is not that expensive.
The more expensive part is getting it installed, but the reduced liability of using one makes that seem cheap by comparison. While I presume that most radio amateurs are savy enough to understand the consequences of backfeeding a generator into the house, too many in the public are ignorant of the fact that AC goes the other way just as easily as it comes into the house. Here's hoping that all without power will receive it soon. 72, de Nate >> -- "The optimist proclaims that we live in the best of all possible worlds. The pessimist fears this is true." Ham radio, Linux, bikes, and more: http://www.n0nb.us
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